“Evil Does Not Exist” Interview with director Ryusuke Hamaguchi. Carefully portraying the perspective of “I can’t say either way” | CINRA

“Evil Doesn’t Exist”, directed by Ryusuke Hamaguchi, was created in collaboration with musician Eiko Ishibashi, with whom he hit it off with “Drive My Car” (2021). This is a feature-length film that was created along with Ishibashi’s live silent video work “GIFT” after receiving an offer from Ishibashi to produce a video.

The story, which revolves around a construction plan for a glamping site in the naturally rich town of Nagano, poses a variety of questions to the viewer that cannot be divided into simple dichotomies such as countryside and city, or nature and city. “The reality is not as clearly divided as we think,” Hamaguchi says. In fact, that indivisibility seems to be at the core of this work. Author Minori Suzuki spoke to us.

I was very confused by the first shot of “Evil Exists,” which is also used in the trailer. I thought the music by Eiko Ishibashi overlapped with shots of the forest in the mountains of Mizuhiki-cho (a fictional town) in Nagano Prefecture, where this movie is set, moving from below, and it was very beautiful. To.

As the music progresses from an ominous introduction led by repeated hi-hat hits and electric guitar distortion to a focus on strings, as time passes, it appears as if a snowy mountain has been photographed from above, and the collected water and plants It looks like someone is looking through a microscope and observing it. During those four minutes, I wondered if we, or rather, I, could easily feel the lyricism in the music, especially in live instruments like strings. Why am I so moved by shots that simply capture trees? The experience of watching this film, which is filled with questions and variations on these questions, made me feel a force trying to keep me from being swallowed up by these simple emotions.

The story itself is very simple. The number of immigrants is increasing in Mizuhiki-cho, which is said to be close to Tokyo, and the main character Takumi (Hitoshi Omika) and his daughter Hana (Rei Nishikawa) have lived there for generations. A plan is brought up to build a glamping facility in the rural town where they live, and one day an information session is held for the residents. Takumi and other residents are not satisfied with the explanation given by Takahashi (Ryuji Kosaka) and Mayuzumi (Kaiso Shibuya), employees from an entertainment agency, that the plan was planned using subsidies from the government during the coronavirus pandemic. Takumi and his friends, Takahashi, and Mayuzumi interact over a plan that poses concerns about contamination of the forest and water sources that surround the town.

The first thing that caught my attention was the establishment of glamping facilities for tourism in “land rich in nature.” Glamping, which combines the words “glamorous” and “camping,” allows you to experience the outdoors with hotel-like services without having to bring your own camping equipment or tents. In particular, the market has expanded in response to travel needs since 2020, when the coronavirus pandemic began, when people were asked to avoid closed spaces, crowds, and close quarters, and to maintain distance from other people.

What intrigues me about this movie is that it is a story about glamping, which has not yet become popular among the general public but has been attracting attention in recent years, and that the project is being led by an entertainment company whose main business is not tourism. The point is that.

“I heard that the scene of the briefing session for the glamping site actually happened (in a town on the border of Yamanashi and Nagano prefectures where I was doing research for the production), so I used it as a reference. It seems that there was a company involved, so I decided to set this movie as a project for an entertainment agency.

Why should entertainment agencies do this? When I imagined that, in the end, it was difficult for them to survive the coronavirus pandemic with their day jobs, so they decided to use the grants they received to get by somehow…That’s what I decided to do in the story. I don’t know about actual cases.” (Ryusuke Hamaguchi)

This film treats the glamping facility and Mizuhiki-cho not simply as motifs that contrast “city/rural/nature.” It is not being used because of criticisms such as “urban businesses are planning resort facilities for customers coming from the city, polluting nature.” In fact, even in the story of Takumi, who has lived in Mizuhiki-cho for generations, there is a mention that “all the people here are outsiders.”

For example, although I was born in Kochi Prefecture, I have lived in Tokyo for many more years than I have lived there, and both of my parents have moved away from their hometown. If you go back just a few generations, you’ll probably find people in your family who came from various countries and regions, not just Japan. In the same way, in this movie, there is no clear distinction between “local people” and “non-local people.”

Furthermore, the inseparability of “from here is nature/from here is city (civilization)” is also reflected in motifs such as the piano in Takumi’s house, the bird feathers used in the harpsichord, and the udon noodles served using natural spring water. It can be seen from The layout around it is very interesting.

“The elements you mentioned are interspersed, and I think that to some extent it is possible to draw various interpretations from them. However, it is important that these elements are actually true as a result of research. That’s right. Things like cities that are contrasted with nature and countryside are surprisingly muddy.

Even at glamping information sessions, there aren’t that many residents who are simply against it. I’m telling (the company) that I want them to plan properly. What the main character, Takumi, says is, “If I had a good plan, I would be able to talk properly.”

This kind of conciliatory attitude seems to have been the attitude of the residents at the actual briefing sessions that I learned through research. Reality is not as clearly divided as we think, but exists in gradations, where things happen.” (Ryusuke Hamaguchi)

The topic of government subsidies not only for entertainment agencies that lead the glamping business, but also for small and medium-sized businesses whose business has become difficult due to the coronavirus pandemic, comes up in the story. From there, I started to associate movies with subsidies.

At the beginning of the coronavirus pandemic, people self-monitored culture and art in “places where people gather closely,” such as movies and theater, by saying they should “self-restraint” and “maintain distance between people.” While there was a tendency to avoid movie theaters and theaters, there was the problem of a lack of support from the state.

Under these circumstances, Hamaguchi and Koji Fukada became the founders of the “Mini Theater Aid Fund,” a crowdfunding campaign to support mini theaters, which are places that support culture. Furthermore, in order to sustain its activities, the current structure of Japan’s film industry has relied heavily on donations and subsidies, leading to discussions about reconsidering monetization and business viability.

Amidst the lack of public support due to being put off by the government and undervalued by the general public, there was a growing movement to improve the film industry, mainly among people within the film industry, and this film seemed to be a continuation of the industry. Ta.

“Simply, I think that movies and everything depicted in them are connected to my own life.Also, Japanese culture and art and the situations depicted in the movies are also connected.” I also felt that there was a continuity through research before writing the script.

However, that doesn’t mean that I was consciously aware of it, ordered it, and created it as having a cause-and-effect relationship. However, for me, I thought that something like this was happening due to something in the things we were doing in our lives.” (Ryusuke Hamaguchi)

At the time of this interview, I was working part-time at a bar in Shinjuku. Most of the sales there were from tourists from overseas, and I had the impression that there were many visitors from Europe and America, especially white tourists. It’s winter, and I hear from different people on different days that I’m going to arrive in Tokyo, go to Hokkaido, come back to Tokyo, and then go skiing in Hakuba (Nagano). I’ve heard it several times. So, even though this movie didn’t even depict tourists from overseas, beyond the glamping story, I was looking at the inbound tourism policies of the national and local governments.

He also thought that in the tourism industry, the desire to consume could be stimulated by attaching mythical stories and images to places, things, and experiences. During the film, when the introductory video of the glamping facility that is played at the information session switches to the reality of flowers walking in the mountains in the film, it becomes clear that “nature” and “regions” are being objectified as tourist resources. , the power of fiction (mythology) of public relations tailored into a story appears to be melting into reality.

Since the glamping business is led by an entertainment agency, the film’s perspective goes beyond what is depicted in the film, and also covers the inbound tourism policy and the white-dominated social structure. I guessed that it was spreading.

“It’s difficult… but I think it’s too much to see things like Europe and America or white centrism in the background of this movie. I don’t think the story needs to go that far. .

I think this is really our story. This is not to say that there is some other “cause of evil.” What we see as “nature” or “rural areas” and what we normally do in urban areas are not so separate from each other; rather, each and every behavior in our lives is connected. , these events are happening. So, wouldn’t our lifestyle be that much different from attracting glamping, which has its problems? Isn’t that what our lives are all about? This movie was made from this doubt.” (Ryusuke Hamaguchi)

There is a scene in which a flower faces a deer. There is also an episode about the relationship between glamping facilities, deer, and their drinking fountains, but they coexist there… It seems inappropriate to even say such a thing, it is a symbol that it is not that simple. Looked. In addition, near the cow stables where Hana visited, there was a mountain of manure and urine, and the smell was like smoke. This seems to suggest that life should coexist with such things that are excluded in the city.

There is an episode in which a character comes into contact with Mizuhiki Town’s nature and a part of its life and views it favorably, but the work as a whole does not portray “regions” and “nature” as “simply beautiful things.” Not yet.

“Some places that look like they have a lot of nature are actually right next to a huge road, so the gradation of the various elements you’re talking about is something that originally existed in that area. I think that’s the case. I probably discovered that by actually going there.

The reactions and attitudes of the residents at the briefing session I mentioned earlier made me think, “That’s just how it is.” It’s a combination of what I conceptualize (in my head) and what I actually go there and see. There are a lot of things that are different from what I saw before, and I was able to understand that there aren’t many barriers.”

“When we pick up on things that actually exist, I think that rather than coexistence, the reality is that various elements are mixed together without boundaries, much more than we thought.In the first place, there are clearly When things are divided, it feels like a lie. When you can say something clearly, there’s probably something you’re trying not to see.

The biggest thing is that it incorporates to some extent the feelings I got from actually seeing it when I was researching it. It would be an exaggeration to say that I didn’t imply anything. However, most of my works are created by photographing things that are actually there. There is no symbol there. I think the first thing to grasp is what is there. This is because it simultaneously includes things that can be put into words and things that cannot be put into words.” (Ryusuke Hamaguchi)

There is a scene in which Takahashi says, “I want to quit my job in the entertainment industry and become a facility manager.” When I watched that scene at the preview screening, the audience laughed, but I thought it was a pretty cruel scene. This is because we, the audience, especially the “industry people” who come to preview screenings, are consuming movies as culture and art, visual art and entertainment that are closely related to entertainment.

Because I think so, when I find the opening of this movie to be “beautiful,” I can’t just stop at that, and wonder where that perspective comes from in the experience of watching this movie. Then, it became something that was thrust at me in a different form. While there was a sense of beauty and majesty, there were also scenes that were seen as interesting and strange, and I was quite shaken by the experience that only a theater can offer, where you can feel the gap between these two scenes. Just like my viewing experience, I think that the way this movie is viewed and the questions it poses can vary depending on the values ​​and experiences of each individual audience member.

“I wanted to create a story that anyone could relate to, so I don’t want any particular person with an awareness of these issues to see it, but I want everyone to see it.” Ryusuke Hamaguchi)

One of my favorite scenes in this movie, and the one that moved me the most, was the awkward water-fetching scene in the second half. Not only that, but the depiction of streams and wildflowers in the film evoked my memories of the streams I walked through when I was little, and the mushrooms and wildflowers I picked in the mountains. At the same time, can I live there? That makes me have doubts. These ambiguous emotions and delicate scenes are etched into the film.

As a symbol of this, a cut is inserted where someone’s blood is dripping, and when I said that it was a scene where ◯◯ cuts his hand and blood drips…, Mr. Hamaguchi replied, “That’s where the hand was cut.” It’s XX,” and then added, “No, I’m sorry. That’s just what I thought when I took the picture, and it can be interpreted that way.”

Of course, it would be a stretch to say that something that wasn’t actually shown was “actually shown,” but I thought it was an attitude that allowed interpretation based on what was shown.

“Ultimately, I think it’s about shooting in a way that makes you feel whatever you want.That’s why you can laugh at it, and it can also look very cruel and painful. I think what we did in making it was to carefully construct a perspective that said, “I can’t say either way.”

That’s why I’m actually quite happy when you say, “It wasn’t funny.” There are times when I laugh, but there are also times when I feel like I can’t laugh.” (Ryusuke Hamaguchi)